Omaha Vol Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 1 minute ago, HurricaneNick said: Mater Dei didn’t have a single player ranked in Californias top 25 recruits on 247 in 2023 and went 12-1 beating Gorman and splitting with Bosco. Make it make sense 🤷♂️ I bet all 100 of their players were ranked in the top 500, though. That makes for a stacked team! Does that make sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 6 hours ago, MD87 said: Nobody's stopping TX private schools from doing that, but the narrative is that football is bigger at publics, so TX folk say it'll never happen. And yet the fact is that there already are a tiny subset of TX schools that have a disproportionate number of elite players, year in and year out. Is there something special in the water in North Shore and Katy in Houston, or DVille, Allen and DeSoto in Dallas? Of course not. Or maybe it's the coaching? (Umm, no, as MD, SJB, IMG and SFA have made abundantly clear! 😆) I guess those handful of schools are just really damn lucky, year after year after year. Please. While MD and SJB kids don't have to live within a certain geography, a number of elite TX kids intentionally move to public powerhouses there, too; they just have to move to within the school's boundaries. (But, but, but the UIL says no athletic-based transfers! Then why the hell is it happening?) In other words, TX doesn't need to create new all-star teams. They already have them. Yes, MD, SJB, SFA and IMG often (but not always) have more elite athletes than any one TX school - I'm not denying that - but not that many more; certainly not enough to excuse the blowouts that happen every. damn. time. the TX elites play these schools. Where TX schools are disproportionately lacking is coaching and discipline. Shore those things up, and the scores get closer. When MD slaughtered DVille a couple years ago, DVille had something like 15 3-5 star players in just the junior and senior classes combined. No way in hell that 45-3 on their home field (after 3 quarters, at that!) should have happened with that loaded roster. The play calling was abysmal and the discipline was terrible. That's how you get 45-3 after 3. And let's put another myth to bed: MD and SJB get all the best CA players. Yes, MD and SJB have the best collection of overall talent, but they usually don't have the best player in the state at each position. Here's the '25 and '26 breakdown of the state's #1 rated player at each position and their school. Of the 24 positions in '25 and '26, MD has the best player in the state at just 4 of those positions. SJB has none. I'll leave it at that. 2025 QB - Husan Longstreet (Cen10) RB - Jordon Davison (MD) TE - Caleb Edwards (El Dorado Hills) WR - Chris Lawson (Riordan) OL - Jackson Lloyd (Carmel) IOL - Champ Taulealea (Valley Christian) EDGE - Marco Jones (San Ramon Valley) DL - Matthew Johnson (DLS) LB - Matai Tagoa'i (San Clemente) CB - Dijon Lee (Mission Viejo) S - Jadyn Hudson (Pittsburg) ATH - Dylan Robinson (Bonita) 2026 QB - Ryder Lyons (Folsom) RB - Deshonne Redeaux (Oaks Christian) WR - Chris Henry (MD) OL - Kodi Greene (MD) IOL - Sam Utu (Orange Lutheran) TE - Caleb Tafua (Lakewood) EDGE - Samu Moala (Leuzinger) DL - Tom Tom Topui (MD) LB - Talanoa Ili (Orange Lutheran) CB - RJ Sermons (Rancho Cucamonga) S - Davon Benjamin (Oaks Christian) ATH - Brandon Arrington (Mt Miguel) Per 247 recruiting: The ‘21 MD team that beat Duncanville had 10 players in the top 100 for CA, 4 of them top 10! (Class of ‘22) The ‘23 class had 9 in the top 100. (Their soph class-‘24 was talented too and had a few starters) duncanville that year had a total of 5 players in the top 100 for TX in both the ‘22 and ‘23 class and only 1 in the top 25. (#13) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFORDGAWOLVES Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 On 7/13/2024 at 4:31 PM, golfaddict1 said: Solid program. GL to them and I’m sure @BUFORDGAWOLVES will be following closely. We'll see.... bgw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FbDad1986 Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 12 hours ago, MD87 said: Ah, I stand corrected on that. Cen10 didn't travel well (to put it mildly!) last season, so maybe that's a factor, but Cen10 has FIFTEEN dudes 3-star or better in the jr and sr classes (inc, at the most important position, a 5-star who's the #4 QB in the nation), whereas Liberty only has FOUR. I just don't see Liberty winning that. Theses numbers seem to be a little inflated to say the least lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timblacktv Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 13 hours ago, MD87 said: Nobody's stopping TX private schools from doing that, but the narrative is that football is bigger at publics, so TX folk say it'll never happen. And yet the fact is that there already are a tiny subset of TX schools that have a disproportionate number of elite players, year in and year out. Is there something special in the water in North Shore and Katy in Houston, or DVille, Allen and DeSoto in Dallas? Of course not. Or maybe it's the coaching? (Umm, no, as MD, SJB, IMG and SFA have made abundantly clear! 😆) I guess those handful of schools are just really damn lucky, year after year after year. Please. While MD and SJB kids don't have to live within a certain geography, a number of elite TX kids intentionally move to public powerhouses there, too; they just have to move to within the school's boundaries. (But, but, but the UIL says no athletic-based transfers! Then why the hell is it happening?) In other words, TX doesn't need to create new all-star teams. They already have them. Yes, MD, SJB, SFA and IMG often (but not always) have more elite athletes than any one TX school - I'm not denying that - but not that many more; certainly not enough to excuse the blowouts that happen every. damn. time. the TX elites play these schools. Where TX schools are disproportionately lacking is coaching and discipline. Shore those things up, and the scores get closer. When MD slaughtered DVille a couple years ago, DVille had something like 15 3-5 star players in just the junior and senior classes combined. No way in hell that 45-3 on their home field (after 3 quarters, at that!) should have happened with that loaded roster. The play calling was abysmal and the discipline was terrible. That's how you get 45-3 after 3. And let's put another myth to bed: MD and SJB get all the best CA players. Yes, MD and SJB have the best collection of overall talent, but they usually don't have the best player in the state at each position. Here's the '25 and '26 breakdown of the state's #1 rated player at each position and their school. Of the 24 positions in '25 and '26, MD has the best player in the state at just 4 of those positions. SJB has none. I'll leave it at that. 2025 QB - Husan Longstreet (Cen10) RB - Jordon Davison (MD) TE - Caleb Edwards (El Dorado Hills) WR - Chris Lawson (Riordan) OL - Jackson Lloyd (Carmel) IOL - Champ Taulealea (Valley Christian) EDGE - Marco Jones (San Ramon Valley) DL - Matthew Johnson (DLS) LB - Matai Tagoa'i (San Clemente) CB - Dijon Lee (Mission Viejo) S - Jadyn Hudson (Pittsburg) ATH - Dylan Robinson (Bonita) 2026 QB - Ryder Lyons (Folsom) RB - Deshonne Redeaux (Oaks Christian) WR - Chris Henry (MD) OL - Kodi Greene (MD) IOL - Sam Utu (Orange Lutheran) TE - Caleb Tafua (Lakewood) EDGE - Samu Moala (Leuzinger) DL - Tom Tom Topui (MD) LB - Talanoa Ili (Orange Lutheran) CB - RJ Sermons (Rancho Cucamonga) S - Davon Benjamin (Oaks Christian) ATH - Brandon Arrington (Mt Miguel) What about the Stars tho? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norcalnut Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 9 hours ago, Horsefly said: Per 247 recruiting: The ‘21 MD team that beat Duncanville had 10 players in the top 100 for CA, 4 of them top 10! (Class of ‘22) The ‘23 class had 9 in the top 100. (Their soph class-‘24 was talented too and had a few starters) duncanville that year had a total of 5 players in the top 100 for TX in both the ‘22 and ‘23 class and only 1 in the top 25. (#13) And Texas has twice as many football participants so the numbers are skewed. How many in the Texas top 200 at Duncanville would be a even comparison. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 1 hour ago, Norcalnut said: And Texas has twice as many football participants so the numbers are skewed. How many in the Texas top 200 at Duncanville would be a even comparison. The participation numbers include all levels at the HS level, not just varsity. We have very large programs with many kids riding the bench for 4 years. but anyways adding the top 200 for Texas would add 3 more players on the list in total for the ‘22 (2) and ‘23 (1) classes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ga96 Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 https://www.maxpreps.com/m/news/1c2gccbf002sR8JdyFGSxg/high-school-football-rankings-expanding-the-preseason-maxpreps-top-25-all-the-way-to-100.htm?ftag=MPG-03-10aaa3c 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AztecPadre Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 47 minutes ago, Ga96 said: https://www.maxpreps.com/m/news/1c2gccbf002sR8JdyFGSxg/high-school-football-rankings-expanding-the-preseason-maxpreps-top-25-all-the-way-to-100.htm?ftag=MPG-03-10aaa3c Trying to find some ga teams? Lol. JK JK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 2 hours ago, Norcalnut said: And Texas has twice as many football participants so the numbers are skewed. How many in the Texas top 200 at Duncanville would be an even comparison. HurricaneNick and MD87 are right, though. Coaching is the big difference between the prep powers and TX schools. Money doesn’t hurt, either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaShells21 Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 42 minutes ago, Omaha Vol said: HurricaneNick and MD87 are right, though. Coaching is the big difference between the prep powers and TX schools. Money doesn’t hurt, either. Ah-hunh, sure ☺️ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaShells21 Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 1 hour ago, Omaha Vol said: HurricaneNick and MD87 are right, though. Coaching is the big difference between the prep powers and TX schools. Money doesn’t hurt, either. Switch coaching staffs between: 2022 St. John Bosco w/ Lee Wiginton staff vs. Allen w/ Jason Negro coaching staff 2021 Duncanville w/ Bruce Rollinson coaching staff vs. Mater Dei w/ Samples coaching staff. 2020 IMG Academy w/ Reginald Samples coaching staff vs. Duncanville with Billy Miller coaching staff The Bold will win because of their coaching? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 9 minutes ago, SeaShells21 said: Switch coaching staffs between: 2022 St. John Bosco w/ Lee Wiginton staff vs. Allen w/ Jason Negro coaching staff 2021 Duncanville w/ Bruce Rollinson coaching staff vs. Mater Dei w/ Samples coaching staff. 2020 IMG Academy w/ Reginald Samples coaching staff vs. Duncanville with Billy Miller coaching staff The Bold will win because of their coaching? I think it would make a huge difference. It's not like Texas doesn't have the talent.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 26 minutes ago, Omaha Vol said: I think it would make a huge difference. It's not like Texas doesn't have the talent.... There was a significant talent gap. These CA guys are trying their best to downplay MD talent in CA. I can show where this year their players account for 20% of the top 25 talent in CA for both the ‘25 and ‘26 classes. 5 top 25 players in each class! No Texas school monopolizes talent like that here. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaShells21 Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 1 hour ago, Omaha Vol said: I think it would make a huge difference. It's not like Texas doesn't have the talent.... What was the difference between Bruce 1988 - 2016 compared to Post 2017 Bruce? What was the difference between 1991 - 2012 Jason Negro compared to Post 2013 Jason? Same coaches; drastically different results. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ga96 Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 59 minutes ago, Horsefly said: There was a significant talent gap. These CA guys are trying their best to downplay MD talent in CA. I can show where this year their players account for 20% of the top 25 talent in CA for both the ‘25 and ‘26 classes. 5 top 25 players in each class! No Texas school monopolizes talent like that here. Same in Georgia. Even our biggest cheaters like Grayson and Carrollton can't pull in that magnitude. As much as I don't like them. They get about 10% 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champa Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 I see it's that time of year again lol. Not joking when I say I'd like to see Faith Family try their hand at football. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On2whls Posted July 15 Report Share Posted July 15 22 hours ago, timblacktv said: Heard Liberty from Arizona is loaded coming into this year. Think this might be the first year a potential Arizona state champ can beat Corona Centennial. They're 0-3 against them. To my knowledge they played Liberty NV twice and Liberty AZ once. Are you taking liberties with your Liberty's? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliNorth Posted July 16 Report Share Posted July 16 1 hour ago, Horsefly said: There was a significant talent gap. These CA guys are trying their best to downplay MD talent in CA. I can show where this year their players account for 20% of the top 25 talent in CA for both the ‘25 and ‘26 classes. 5 top 25 players in each class! No Texas school monopolizes talent like that here. Even if what you say is true, the amount of talent that DV had, the game should have been way closer . It wasn't even a game . The fundamentals were sorely lacking on DV's end . It was evident that they weren't well coached , or the kids don't buy in like the kids do at privates , or both . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HurricaneNick Posted July 16 Report Share Posted July 16 39 minutes ago, SeaShells21 said: What was the difference between Bruce 1988 - 2016 compared to Post 2017 Bruce? What was the difference between 1991 - 2012 Jason Negro compared to Post 2013 Jason? Same coaches; drastically different results. This is exactly what I’m saying about Duncanvilles roster pre and post Samples. It’s no secret. You can have the best coach but if you don’t have the talent it doesn’t matter. Coaching matters when the teams are loaded of course. But if you put Samples & staff at a mediocre high school the results would be what you would expect. He is a phenomenal coach, and has 2 of the top 3 players in the state of Texas plus a bunch of other studs. It’s the same recipe regardless of state. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted July 16 Report Share Posted July 16 10 minutes ago, CaliNorth said: Even if what you say is true, the amount of talent that DV had, the game should have been way closer . It wasn't even a game . The fundamentals were sorely lacking on DV's end . It was evident that they weren't well coached , or the kids don't buy in like the kids do at privates , or both . I’ve already given the data and it’s accurate, it’s right off the 24/7 site. Talent absolutely was a major factor, depth at all levels. DV was overwhelmed, not unlike any other programs that faced MD for the first time. I think they learned from that as shortly samples brought in a new OC (brought him 2 state titles) MD since 2018 has only lost to 1 program in the entire country…1! MD is not a garden variety program, just elite from coaching alone. Its more than coaching, they have a stronghold on talent too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HurricaneNick Posted July 16 Report Share Posted July 16 8 minutes ago, CaliNorth said: Even if what you say is true, the amount of talent that DV had, the game should have been way closer . It wasn't even a game . The fundamentals were sorely lacking on DV's end . It was evident that they weren't well coached , or the kids don't buy in like the kids do at privates , or both . It should have been closer yes, especially at home, but they're right that MD was just more talented. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaShells21 Posted July 16 Report Share Posted July 16 2 hours ago, Omaha Vol said: I think it would make a huge difference. It's not like Texas doesn't have the talent.... 2008: Cypress Bay (Fl.) 6 - Katy 31 2009: Cypress Bay (Fl.) 0 - S.T. Aquinas 36 2010: Skyline 3 - S.T. Aquinas (Fl.) 31 Skyline (Tx.) 0 - DeSoto 38 2010: Plant (Fl.) 17 - Abilene (Tx.) 27 Plant (Fl.) 7 - St. Thomas Aquinas 29 2014: IMG Academy 69 - Prestonwood (Tx.) 36 Bishop Dunne (Tx.) 42 - Prestonwood 10 2015: Euless Trinity 26 - De La Salle 21 Euless Trinity 42 - North Shore 32 Cen10nial 21 - De La Salle 28 2015: Allen (Tx.) 56 - Viera 20 St. Thomas Aquinas 41 - Viera 10 2015: DeSoto 29 - IMG Academy 47 DeSoto 26 - Arlington Martin (Tx.) 46 2019: Duncanville 35 - St John’s 14 IMG Academy 35 - St. John’s 20 Duncanville 17 - North Shore 34 [2019] 2020: Duncanville 14 - IMG Academy 41 2021: Westfield (TX) 27 - North Shore 21 Duncanville 10 - North Shore 17 [9 other teams that North Shore played scored more than Duncanville did.] C.E. King (TX) 0 - North Shore 17 Duncanville 3 - Mater Dei 45 Allen 20 vs. Atascocita 41 [2021] Allen 14 vs. Carroll 47 [2021] 1:50 2022: Allen 14 - St John Bosco 52 Allen 7 - Guyer (Tx.) 49 [End of 3rd] DeSoto 7 - St. Frances 47 DeSoto 10 - Duncanville 41 [4:36 | 4th] Bishop Gorman 56 - Liberty 14 Atascocita 45 - Liberty (NV.) 8 Pittsburg (CA.) 30 - Liberty 2 2023: East St. Louis 13 - St. Frances 7 East St. Louis 13 - Atascocita 43 Is there really that much difference between the coaching at power privates and Texas publics? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted July 16 Report Share Posted July 16 22 minutes ago, HurricaneNick said: It should have been closer yes, especially at home, but they're right that MD was just more talented. Being at home has nothing to do with it when there’s a wide gap in talent. a good ex. of program maturation is Cen10. Centennial is a great public school program, they’re 0-5/6 v MD going back to ‘18. Those first two losses were blowouts similar to DV.(2018/20219) They have learned and grown as a program and closed the gap some. DV has grown too, offense is not the same it was a few years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaShells21 Posted July 16 Report Share Posted July 16 27 minutes ago, CaliNorth said: Even if what you say is true, the amount of talent that DV had, the game should have been way closer . It wasn't even a game . The fundamentals were sorely lacking on DV's end . It was evident that they weren't well coached , or the kids don't buy in like the kids do at privates , or both . 13 minutes ago, HurricaneNick said: It should have been closer yes, especially at home, but they're right that MD was just more talented. Switch the coaching staffs between: 2022 St. John Bosco w/ Lee Wiginton staff vs. Allen w/ Jason Negro coaching staff 2021 Duncanville w/ Bruce Rollinson coaching staff vs. Mater Dei w/ Samples coaching staff. 2020 IMG Academy w/ Reginald Samples coaching staff vs. Duncanville with Billy Miller coaching staff Do the bold teams win these matchups? I would just like to hear what you guys think about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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