De La Salle vs. Serra San Mateo

[Belly Bob]

1 hour ago, THEOC89 said:

Right now DLS has no Chance against Folsom or ST Mary’s….. ↳
↳

I like their chances against Folsom, only because Serra was able to shut down their offense and sack the QB 9 times. 

But who knows. Maybe Folsom will figure it out by the time they play DLS. 

[Belly Bob]

1 hour ago, THEOC89 said:

↳For years, DLS ran the veer against loaded boxes and was successful hitting opportunistic passes..,. Not this hybrid, dumb formation with the QB (who’s not a passer) in the Shotgun 75% of the time nonsense…. ↳

It ironic because JA started this offense to “Compete”  with MD and SJB and Attract better players, especially at QB…. They will now have missed the Open against MD or SJB 3 straight years and have gotten worse at attracting any kind of top talent…. 🤣 ↳

This is the 5th season they've been running this newfangled offense, and it doesn't look any better than it did. In fact, it looked better under Hale, and it didn't look good then. 

The crazy thing for me is that they're obviously still teaching the veer, because when the backups came in at the end of the game, they were running the veer. 

What are they thinking? I don't get it. 

[THEOC89]

1 hour ago, Extremely Humble said:

Correct me if I’m wrong, but if DLS was still a top team, don’t you think a lot of those ballers on Serra would be at DLS? I know one of Serra’s better players transferred from DLS. Wonder how many of those kids would be in Concord if DLS was still a powerhouse…

The one kid that Transferred to Serra was Alapati who I believe is going to Army…. But he lives in San Mateo and was commuting to Concord every day which is an awful commute…. So he transferred to Serra last year which is in San Mateo…..

DLS has never drawn players from that area, it’s been the players from over the hill in Antioch, Pittsburg, players moving from the Sac Area or the Oakland and Berkeley areas…. Most of the other players come from the San Ramon, Danville, Dublin and Pleasanton areas…. 

Players don’t Value playing at DLS as much as they used to and are staying at their public schools…. This is happening in Baseball now as well….

[old_e]

Matt Gutierrez use to sling the rock pretty good at DLS.

[THEOC89]

45 minutes ago, Belly Bob said:

Dorian Hale might've been something special, but I'm not sure DLS knows how to develop QBs. Hale was getting snaps as a freshman and started for three straight years, but he never developed the ability to find the open man or deliver an accurate pass consistently. I wonder how he would've done in a system that knows how to develop a passing game.

DLS had Carson Su'esu'e. 6'5" 200 lbs w/ several Power 5 offers. But he couldn't run the veer, so they benched him early last season for the kid they have now, and Carson transferred. Naturally. 

So, they want to attract QBs, but they also want to run the veer, but they also want to pass out of the shotgun with a single offset back or maybe even no backs at all. That's what I'd do, too. I'd do it all. 

I'd take my QB who's good at throwing the ball and then I'd put him under center and have him run the veer. Then I'd put in my running QB and I'd go w/ an empty set, have him roll to his right, even though he throws with his left arm, and I'd have him throw it deep.

I'd also teach my line to drive block, because that's really important for the veer, but then on Friday nights, I'd move the pocket to the right to protect my running QB while he made difficult throws on the run to his tiny, sophomore receivers. 

That's what I'd do if I were in charge. 

Hale was actually the Best QB for this system they are trying to run…. Becauae he could run the Veer and he could pass….

The problem was, when they played better competition the O-Line could not pass block at all so Hale had no time… but he was mobile enough to make plays….

Look at 2018 their last “Great” season when they beat Folsom and BG…. DLS passed only like 10 or 11 times against Folsom and Ran 40+ times against a stacked box…. They won 14-0….

Against BG they passed less than 10 times and ran 40+ times against a stacked box…. I was at that game and BG had everyone within 5 yards of the LOS except a safety playing about 10 yards deep…  DLS won 27-21….

The next year is when they went all in on the Hybrid system…. DLS passed 24 times against STA, Hale couldn’t hit any open receivers because he had no time to throw and DLS lost 24-14….

The problem is not with running the Veer, it is they fact they don’t do anything well anymore…. When they stuck to the veer and opportunistic passing they were just fine because their line was so good at blocking the veer they could handle the stacked box and their RB’s hit the holes so quickly they could break big plays against a stacked box….  Or the QB could make a play action throw because the pass rush had to respect the run….

They need to scrap all this nonsense and go back to the basics…. They have a good looking line this year, they should be able to move the bal but once again, the line is put in a position of failure because they are not a pass blocking line….

[THEOC89]

29 minutes ago, old_e said:

Matt Gutierrez use to sling the rock pretty good at DLS.

Yes he did…. And it was out of the Veer…. 🤣

[Belly Bob]

22 minutes ago, THEOC89 said:

The problem is not with running the Veer, it is they fact they don’t do anything well anymore…. When they stuck to the veer and opportunistic passing they were just fine because their line was so good at blocking the veer they could handle the stacked box and their RB’s hit the holes so quickly they could break big plays against a stacked box….  Or the QB could make a play action throw because the pass rush had to respect the run….

They need to scrap all this nonsense and go back to the basics…. They have a good looking line this year, they should be able to move the bal but once again, the line is put in a position of failure because they are not a pass blocking line….

I'd like to see them go back to the veer also. They know how to run the veer. It's a fun offense to watch. It's their tradition. I'm a traditional guy.

My second preference would be for them to abandon the veer altogether and develop a different kind of offense. HS football has changed a lot. Kids want to be QBs and wide receivers now. But DLS would probably have to find people who could teach such an offense.

My third preference would be for them to carry on with this odd hybrid thing they've been doing. I don't blame them for trying it. But I think we've seen enough to say that it doesn't work. 

[Belly Bob]

36 minutes ago, THEOC89 said:

↳Look at 2018 their last “Great” season when they beat Folsom and BG…. DLS passed only like 10 or 11 times against Folsom and Ran 40+ times against a stacked box…. They won 14-0…. ↳

Against BG they passed less than 10 times and ran 40+ times against a stacked box…. I was at that game and BG had everyone within 5 yards of the LOS except a safety playing about 10 yards deep…  DLS won 27-21…. ↳

I really enjoyed that BG game. DLS wasn't yet nationally ranked and BG had beat them decisively in their previous matchup. The kids played hard. And if I remember correctly, the counters started hitting in the 2nd half.

DLS had more explosive plays in the 2nd half of that game, running the veer against a stacked box, than they've had in their last three games combined. 

[THEOC89]

1 minute ago, Belly Bob said:

I really enjoyed that BG game. DLS wasn't yet nationally ranked and BG had beat them decisively in their previous matchup. The kids played hard. And if I remember correctly, the counters started hitting in the 2nd half.

DLS had more explosive plays in the 2nd half of that game, running the veer against a stacked box, then they've had in their last three games combined. 

That was one of my favorite DLS games I have been to!…. Too’Too had 2 long TD runs and him and Garrett were almost unstoppable…. Both had well over 100 yards rushing… 

Garrett or Hale had a fumble after a nice run when DLS was driving or DLS may have had another TD….

I also really enjoyed the STA game the following year…. Although DLS lost and it was frustrating with all the incomplete passes, DLS looked like they belonged on the field with STA and could have won that game…. it was a fun game and a great atmosphere….

The problem now, is they just look overmatched and out of sync… It started with the SFA game 2 years ago and now we have yesterday’s result…. 

[Belly Bob]

45 minutes ago, THEOC89 said:

↳I also really enjoyed the STA game the following year…. Although DLS lost and it was frustrating with all the incomplete passes, DLS looked like they belonged on the field with STA and could have won that game…. it was a fun game and a great atmosphere…. ↳

The problem now, is they just look overmatched and out of sync… It started with the SFA game 2 years ago and now we have yesterday’s result….  ↳

The STA game made me think that the new offense might work. It still felt like they were running the veer, and when they did pass, guys were open, but Hale couldn't find them or couldn't deliver an accurate ball. It felt like they'd have something if they could just tighten it up a bit, maybe execute a little better. But it never happened.

Watching the SFA game made me think that DLS wouldn't win another open division state championship unless things changed radically at DLS or in SoCal. Coach A had said that he wanted to schedule a team like SFA early in the year to give the kids an idea of what they would be up against in the Open. But that must've been counterproductive, because SFA moved the ball like DLS's defense wasn't on the field. 

[THEOC89]

11 minutes ago, Belly Bob said:

The STA game made me think that the new offense might work. It still felt like they were running the veer, and when they did pass, guys were open, but Hale couldn't find them or couldn't deliver an accurate ball. It felt like they'd have something if they could just tighten it up a bit, maybe execute a little better. But it never happened.

Watching the SFA game made me think that DLS wouldn't win another open division state championship unless things changed radically at DLS or in SoCal. Coach A had said that he wanted to schedule a team like SFA early in the year to give the kids an idea of what they would be up against in the Open. But that must've been counterproductive, because SFA moved the ball like DLS's defense wasn't on the field. 

I thought the same thing regarding the STA game…. It did work to some extent as Hale threw for 200+ yards agains SJB in the open game…. Had a huge one like a 60 yard TD to Garrett called back as well on a bogus penalty….

I was at the SFA game and that was the first time I have ever seen a DLS game where DLS looked intimidated and thought they were going to lose….

Other than Zeke Barry, it looked like they did t even want to hit the SFA players…. It was so noticeable that everyone I was sitting with at the game saw the same thing….

[Extremely Humble]

5 hours ago, On2whls said:

If kids aren’t going to DLS because it’s not a top program, what do they think another program will offer?

A better system. Why would a great qb or wr ever want to play in that archaic offense? 
 

[badrouter]

10 minutes ago, Extremely Humble said:

A better system. Why would a great qb or wr ever want to play in that archaic offense? 
 

The veer was "archaic" as of the mid 1990s. It was "archaic" for basically the entire streak. Part of why it is/was archaic is the whims of fans and "the market" at the pro level. So, not a "football" reason. From a football perspective, *anything* that is executed well with players who fit the system well will be effective, assuming talent is fairly comparable. DLS gets overwhelmed against SJB, STA, MD etc because talent hasn't been comparable. And talent will never be comparable, unless DLS goes hardcore into recruiting all of Northern California. Just installing a scheme, which the program has never run, but which is used by most every other school isn't going to magically attract studs. 

DLS should do what DLS did for decades. They aren't going to compete with the elite at the state or national level without doing much more in recruiting. And, they may not want to go there. Can't blame them if they don't...

[badrouter]

How might the veer look if they had 3-4 Power 5 OLs, a couple of Power 5 backs, and an elite athlete (if not pure QB) at QB? I promise you they'd give everyone trouble. Particularly because they'd be unique-difficult to prepare for- in addition to being loaded with talent.

[THEOC89]

2 hours ago, Extremely Humble said:

A better system. Why would a great qb or wr ever want to play in that archaic offense? 
 

That Archaic offense had no problem rolling Folsom the 1st 4 times they played…. It wasn’t until the Hybrid was in full effect that Folsom Best DLS….

DLS has had as many QB’s and WR go on to play in College and NFL out of their archaic system as Folsom has in their “Modern System”…. 

it has nothing to do with the system and everything to do with the fact kids don’t need to go to DLS to get recruited anymore…

Unless DLS built Dorms and recruited all of Nor Cal and gave scholarships to players and housed them, there is no way they can compete…. No one in Nor Cal Can, it’s geographicly not possible up here….

DLS can run the veer and Coach their kids up like they always have and compete just fine in Nor Cal…. The dream of winning the Open is gone, just as it is for all Nor Cal Teams and it’s time to let it go and get back to basics….

[THEOC89]

1 hour ago, badrouter said:

How might the veer look if they had 3-4 Power 5 OLs, a couple of Power 5 backs, and an elite athlete (if not pure QB) at QB? I promise you they'd give everyone trouble. Particularly because they'd be unique-difficult to prepare for- in addition to being loaded with talent.

Exactly!!!… No one complained about running the Veer in 2018 when DLS shut out Folsom’s “Modern Offense” and beat BG….

The Difference?…. DLS had 2 players from that team Drafted into the NFL this year…. Go Figure…. 🤣

[Cal 14]

A couple of things seem odd…

1.  DLS has a pretty good baseball program.  Have they at least tried to lure one of their pitchers to see if they could want to learn to play QB?

2.  The entire NCS is really not especially good these days.  No one still has been able to beat the Spartans, yet both the CCS and SJS have multiple teams that have done it in the last few years.  Its D-1 finalist last year took losses against CCS and SJS teams that couldn’t get past their respective semis.  The D-2 winner from two seasons ago got blasted 42-0 by the CCS D-I 8 seed.  As far as DLS as fallen, you might think that talent is still in the area but is promoting other schools, yet the results don’t bear that out.

[THEOC89]

7 hours ago, Cal 14 said:

A couple of things seem odd…

1.  DLS has a pretty good baseball program.  Have they at least tried to lure one of their pitchers to see if they could want to learn to play QB?

The DLS baseball Coach does not like Baseball players playing FB, because if the risk of injuries and he wants the baseball players dedicated to baseball…. And he doesn’t need to because he has 35 players On Varsity, 35 players on JV and 2 Frosh teams….

The baseball players are expected play year round at DLS, lift weights, etc…. 

It’s ironic because The Baseball Coach was actually a FB Coach at DLS before he took the Baseball job back in 2011… 🤣

[old_e]

On 9/3/2023 at 12:21 PM, THEOC89 said:

Yes he did…. And it was out of the Veer…. 🤣

DLS needs to go back to their bread and butter.  Add a few spread option plays to keep the defense honest.

[QPRTrinity]

5 hours ago, old_e said:

DLS needs to go back to their bread and butter.  Add a few spread option plays to keep the defense honest.

How are they going to recruit the best kids from pop warner then?  Kids want to be in a translatable offense that can help with their recruitment.  NFL and College teams don't run the ball like they use too.  The days of Priest Holmes, Ladanian, Adrian Foster, and Cedric Benson (RIP) are over.  

[PopsNW]

On 9/3/2023 at 8:01 PM, Extremely Humble said:

Correct me if I’m wrong, but if DLS was still a top team, don’t you think a lot of those ballers on Serra would be at DLS? I know one of Serra’s better players transferred from DLS. Wonder how many of those kids would be in Concord if DLS was still a powerhouse…

None.... DLS and Serra are 90+ minutes apart during traffic.  Enrollment areas don't intersect.  Maybe Hayward, but I've never heard of a DLS player from Hayward (except Aaron Taylor, but he was also from Marin, so complicated)

[Cal 14]

On 9/3/2023 at 10:01 AM, Extremely Humble said:

Correct me if I’m wrong, but if DLS was still a top team, don’t you think a lot of those ballers on Serra would be at DLS? I know one of Serra’s better players transferred from DLS. Wonder how many of those kids would be in Concord if DLS was still a powerhouse…

Given that Serra runs the more modern offense, by this logic, would you expect more Spartans to become Padres?

On that note, SoCal teams still seem to be calling DLS for games.  How long before they start calling Serra instead?

[QPRTrinity]

2 hours ago, Cal 14 said:

Given that Serra runs the more modern offense, by this logic, would you expect more Spartans to become Padres?

On that note, SoCal teams still seem to be calling DLS for games.  How long before they start calling Serra instead?

Coach Walsh already agreed to play DLS and the mighty Folsom for 2024 and 2025.  There is a third spot remaining but I don't think Walsh wants to head down south unless you pay for air flight, hotel, and food.

[Cal 14]

6 hours ago, QPRTrinity said:

Coach Walsh already agreed to play DLS and the mighty Folsom for 2024 and 2025.  There is a third spot remaining but I don't think Walsh wants to head down south unless you pay for air flight, hotel, and food.

Serra has traveled to SoCal before for a regular season game.

[maxchoboian]

On 9/4/2023 at 10:23 AM, THEOC89 said:

The DLS baseball Coach does not like Baseball players playing FB, because if the risk of injuries and he wants the baseball players dedicated to baseball…. And he doesn’t need to because he has 35 players On Varsity, 35 players on JV and 2 Frosh teams….

The baseball players are expected play year round at DLS, lift weights, etc…. 

It’s ironic because The Baseball Coach was actually a FB Coach at DLS before he took the Baseball job back in 2011… 🤣

That's a disappointing attitude for a high school coach, particularly if it is well known among the kids that playing a sport in addition to baseball is frowned upon. Pretty selfish of the coach -- I've never agreed with that approach.