Whiteshoes Top 100 - September 5, 2017

[Mjd33]

16 minutes ago, 1DayPGA said:

 If last Saturday's game would've been played on SJC's home field I think they win big over DLS. 

Not sure about big .... that's a strong word. Favored at home? Yes. Home team has tremendous advantage when other coming from 3 time zones away. Right now dls and sjc should be joined at the hip in national rankings. 

[1DayPGA]

6 minutes ago, Mjd33 said:

Not sure about big .... that's a strong word. Favored at home? Yes. Home team has tremendous advantage when other coming from 3 time zones away. Right now dls and sjc should be joined at the hip in national rankings. 

Fair assessment. I guess I should have said SJC wins by double digits. I must've been going by historical East Coast travel games by DLS. They have not been a good OOS road team on that side of the Mississippi in many many years.  

[ECHS05]

2 hours ago, Pops said:

I agree that SJC is a top 25 team, but saying they'd win by 3 TDs at home is hogwash -- should we rank SJB over STA since an OT game on the road is really an SJB win

not sure how you can say IMG at #1 either -- MD just pummeled top 5 and 3x defending MNC BG and IMG was extremely fortunate to pull a W out against CC's #3 QB that hadn't even practiced at the position -- CC might have been best team in their schedule but that result makes other IMG opponents (i.e. sJC) MORE competitive 

Lol...

You can tell Pops is in the thread when the shit starts getting so deep it begins to fill your eyes, ears, and mouth.

BGs MNC group is gone.

Cen10 lost 40-20. They were doubled up. By 20 points.

You are a tool.

Thanks.

[Pops]

53 minutes ago, 1DayPGA said:

Pops, you have to admit when DLS was down 21-7 at the half you thought this had all the makings of a boat race. DLS made a great come back but with the heat, travel, time change, and one less day of preparation SJC was clearly fatigued in the 2nd half and it showed. If last Saturday's game would've been played on SJC's home field I think they win big over DLS. 

Regarding BG getting pummeled by MD you do know that Tate Martell, Biaggio Walsh and a host of other players are no longer on the team right. Yes, that was a good win for MD but Gorman is not the team that they were last year or the year before that. 

IMG flying cross country 2 weeks in a row and beating 2 top rated teams makes a big statement. They are a traveling all star team. As much as it pains me I would put them at #1 and MD at #2 at this point.   

Still not buying the SJC score being different -- maybe, maybe not, but I find humorous the east coast guys complaining about the time differences -- it's much harder to travel west to east and humidity is a foreign environment most west coast kids have never experienced.  Yes, I thought DLS was in trouble -- I even cued the fat lady at 31-14, but DLS came back and won that -- I've seen DLS outcondition other teams before -- they certainly weren't going to be bigger than those beasts.  Check the game thread and all the DLS guys were pinning their hopes on conditioning helping the 2nd half be different which is exactly what happened.  Those big SJC guys were gassed, not sleepy.  Playing road games is a challenge in high school -- DLS has lost games in NJ, FL, and TX.  As I said, I do concur that SJC a legit top 25 team and think they'll make a game if it with IMG.

dont agree on IMG and Md -- in fact, I would have dropped IMG for a bit of a stinky performance under the circumstances.  BG isn't BG '14-16, but they're still a top team and MD throttled them more soundly than the score indicated without their highest rated player.

[Pops]

29 minutes ago, 1DayPGA said:

Fair assessment. I guess I should have said SJC wins by double digits. I must've been going by historical East Coast travel games by DLS. They have not been a good OOS road team on that side of the Mississippi in many many years.  

DLS has 3 losses east of Mississippi

#1 to last consensus MNC

#2 to An STA team that had just knocked off the #1 team on the road

#3 to a top TX team that also beat the TX state champs

dls "not being a good OOS team" has something to do with who they play

[ThunderRam]

1 hour ago, 1DayPGA said:

but with the heat, travel, time change, and one less day of preparation SJC was clearly fatigued in the 2nd half and it showed. If last Saturday's game would've been played on SJC's home field I think they win big over DLS.

I gotta ask, why are these factors legit in this instance, but are labeled just an excuse when a West Coast team loses back East or even in Texas? Nobody seems to care about travel, fatigue or heat when a CA team loses an OOS game on the road. And the West team loses 3 hours compared to gaining 3 hours the opposite way. Nobody cares that Centennial played 3 quarters w/o a legit QB, but if SJC would have been minus their QB it would have suddenly been a legit reason.

These excuses are being applied and legitimized subjectively.

How about the possibility that DLS was just a better team over the entire course of a 48 minute game? They were better conditioned and made better adjustments, which are, you know, a big part of any football game. Just as Trinity was better than DLS over the course of 48 minutes when they played out in Texas in 2015.

FWIW, having a lead at halftime or being up 2 TD's doesn't ensure a win nor does it mean the team that got out to the fast start is clearly the better team. Just ask the 1993 Houston Oliers or 2017 Texas A&M Aggies.

[1DayPGA]

11 minutes ago, Pops said:

dont agree on IMG and Md -- in fact, I would have dropped IMG for a bit of a stinky performance under the circumstances.  BG isn't BG '14-16, but they're still a top team and MD throttled them more soundly than the score indicated without their highest rated player.

I'm a fan of the Stache and his program I'd be happy if he wins a national title I just don't think they could beat IMG. I do think you may see BG with a few losses on their schedule this year. 

8 minutes ago, Pops said:

DLS has 3 losses east of Mississippi

#1 to last consensus MNC

#2 to An STA team that had just knocked off the #1 team on the road

#3 to a top TX team that also beat the TX state champs

dls "not being a good OOS team" has something to do with who they play

No question that the Spartans lost to top rated opponents I was pointing out that they hadn't won back East since the Herbie.

[Pops]

35 minutes ago, ECHS05 said:

Lol...

You can tell Pops is in the thread when the shit starts getting so deep it begins to fill your eyes, ears, and mouth.

BGs MNC group is gone.

Cen10 lost 40-20. They were doubled up. By 20 points.

You are a tool.

Thanks.

Unbundle your panties 

[Pops]

1 minute ago, 1DayPGA said:

 I do think you may see BG with a few losses on their schedule this year. 

I predicted a 2-2 start for BG

theyre still a top team -- they just got beat by a better one and may again in next week or two (then their season is done)

[Mjd33]

1 hour ago, Pops said:

-- it's much harder to travel west to east and humidity is a foreign environment most west coast kids have never experienced.  

The opposite is actually true. 

https://www.medpagetoday.com/meetingcoverage/apss/58591

Wise guys in Vegas know it's easier for teams traveling  from west to east as well and it's reflected in lines. 

 

[Mjd33]

I'd say the biggest problem in oos games is officiating. The zebras from the home states are very likely to see the home team/coaches again and not the oos team. Human nature tells us home team gets more calls. 

[Pops]

14 minutes ago, Mjd33 said:

The opposite is actually true. 

https://www.medpagetoday.com/meetingcoverage/apss/58591

Wise guys in Vegas know it's easier for teams traveling  from west to east as well and it's reflected in lines. 

 

Interesting but you are leaping to conclusions 

example -- em west coast teams in NFL, MLB, NBA have a higher winning percentage in east than vice Versa"

apparently how good teams are wasn't a factor -- lucky the Golden Stare Warriors had a circadian advantage over the Cavs

rge LV reference was reaching and anecdotal -- specifically did. It say that it's a factor in lines

[Pops]

12 minutes ago, Mjd33 said:

I'd say the biggest problem in oos games is officiating. The zebras from the home states are very likely to see the home team/coaches again and not the oos team. Human nature tells us home team gets more calls. 

Interesting

blatantly true in Ga

hinestly haven't felt either robbed or advantaged in DLS OOS games

i think DLS gets jobbed big time against local/ EBAL opponents -- refs have a tendency you to root for underdog also

[PrepGridiron]

21 minutes ago, Mjd33 said:

The opposite is actually true. 

https://www.medpagetoday.com/meetingcoverage/apss/58591

Wise guys in Vegas know it's easier for teams traveling  from west to east as well and it's reflected in lines. 

 

I see your article and raise you:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/jet-lag-is-tougher-when-traveling-east-but-precautions-can-ease-its-effects/2012/12/24/e75305f8-3a67-11e2-b01f-5f55b193f58f_story.html?utm_term=.11e91ff8530b

BTW, I thought that study in your link is a little short sited as everyone knows the Western Conference is far better than the Eastern Conference in basketball and that NFL teams play at 1PM and 4PM EST which equates differently than late night the HS kids play. 

[MA Fan]

Martinsburg is the dominant program in West Virginia, but it's a reach to rank them when they don't play anyone. Not sure even Martinsburg people would claim that they're ahead of every public school team in MD or VA.

[ECHS05]

23 minutes ago, Pops said:

Interesting

blatantly true in Ga

hinestly haven't felt either robbed or advantaged in DLS OOS games

i think DLS gets jobbed big time against local/ EBAL opponents -- refs have a tendency you to root for underdog also

VM had hardly any flags in GA. The officiating actually helped them keep the score 26-7 instead of 30-7.

The next week at Mission Viejo they had 12 flags... TWELVE...before I fell asleep early in the 3rd quarter. Wrap your head around that. That contributed a lot to the score. 

[PrepGridiron]

Just now, MA Fan said:

Martinsburg is the dominant program in West Virginia, but it's a reach to rank them when they don't play anyone. Not sure even Martinsburg people would claim that they're ahead of every public school team in MD or VA.

Was reading about Wise in DC area, they are ranked higher than St. John's

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/highschools/football-top-20-westfield-good-counsel-and-hayfield-join-the-rankings/2017/09/04/ff5f9b10-90d5-11e7-8754-d478688d23b4_story.html?utm_term=.cdce66e6fb9d

[1DayPGA]

2 hours ago, ThunderRam said:

I gotta ask, why are these factors legit in this instance, but are labeled just an excuse when a West Coast team loses back East or even in Texas? Nobody seems to care about travel, fatigue or heat when a CA team loses an OOS game on the road. And the West team loses 3 hours compared to gaining 3 hours the opposite way. Nobody cares that Centennial played 3 quarters w/o a legit QB, but if SJC would have been minus their QB it would have suddenly been a legit reason.

These excuses are being applied and legitimized subjectively.

How about the possibility that DLS was just a better team over the entire course of a 48 minute game? They were better conditioned and made better adjustments, which are, you know, a big part of any football game. Just as Trinity was better than DLS over the course of 48 minutes when they played out in Texas in 2015.

FWIW, having a lead at halftime or being up 2 TD's doesn't ensure a win nor does it mean the team that got out to the fast start is clearly the better team. Just ask the 1993 Houston Oliers or 2017 Texas A&M Aggies.

If you were at the game or watched it on TV you could see that SJC, was clearly fatigued in the 2nd half. Do I think that the heat and them being affected by traveling added to that, yes. Why, well as you know the Bay Area was experiencing an unprecedented heat wave in fact all other hs football games in the San Ramon Valley were postponed on Friday due to the heat. You stated the West team loses 3hrs when traveling for an East Coast game. Well, you can say that SJC lost 21hrs since this game was played on a Friday nite instead of a Sat. nite. I do agree DLS was in better condition, and made some good adjustments in the 2nd half. Not sure what the QB's at Cent. has to do with this post. 

[golfaddict1]

52 minutes ago, PrepGridiron said:

Was reading about Wise in DC area, they are ranked higher than St. John's

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/highschools/football-top-20-westfield-good-counsel-and-hayfield-join-the-rankings/2017/09/04/ff5f9b10-90d5-11e7-8754-d478688d23b4_story.html?utm_term=.cdce66e6fb9d

The Washington Post knows 7A FL means business!   "Florida powerhouse Viera" 😃

Everytime I see Spalding listed I think of this.  

 

[Cat_Scratch]

11 hours ago, Mr.miami305 said:

Carol City is better then Booker T, Cocoa and Armwood... I don't have much faith in Booker T this year.

How do you know?

All teams start a little slow at the beginning of the year.

Cocoa is loaded again this year.

[ThunderRam]

1 hour ago, 1DayPGA said:

If you were at the game or watched it on TV you could see that SJC, was clearly fatigued in the 2nd half. Do I think that the heat and them being affected by traveling added to that, yes. Why, well as you know the Bay Area was experiencing an unprecedented heat wave in fact all other hs football games in the San Ramon Valley were postponed on Friday due to the heat.

I did watch the game. I watched both marquee games last FRI night. I even went back and re-watched parts of the game since it was tough to focus on both at the same time. Furthermore, I'm not saying you are necessarily wrong. But it goes both ways. When West teams travel East, and especially to the South, they aren't accustomed to the humidity. But that's never accepted as a valid excuse. And many would argue that humidity is tougher to deal with than the near 100 degrees of dry heat at around an 8pm kickoff time. By the time 2nd half started, the weather was no worse that what these kids deal with back on the East coast with the humidity. Regardless, both teams had to endure the same conditions and DLS was no more accustomed to it than was SJC. It was a rare occurrence. FWIW, reports suggest a high of around 86 for this weekends games.

 

1 hour ago, 1DayPGA said:

You stated the West team loses 3hrs when traveling for an East Coast game. Well, you can say that SJC lost 21hrs since this game was played on a Friday nite instead of a Sat. nite. I do agree DLS was in better condition, and made some good adjustments in the 2nd half.

Ok, well, St. John Bosco just played in Ft. Lauderdale on FRI night. When DLS played there in 2011, they also played on a FRI night. So they faced the same situation as SJC but lost an additional 3 hrs. And had to play in humidity they are not accustomed to. When both teams lost to Aquinas, I didn't see East coast fan bringing any of this to attention or buying into it at all. If any of the CA fans would have suggested the results would have been different if played at home, what type of response do you think they would have received in return? That's the point I'm getting at. It only seems to be valid once it happens to whatever team or area that person happens to champion.

 

1 hour ago, 1DayPGA said:

Not sure what the QB's at Cent. has to do with this post. 

It was cited as another example of how nobody wants to hear or buy into perceived excuses until it happens to apply to their team/area once they are on the losing end. The IMG supporters and/or anti-Centennial/CA crowd is completely dismissing the impact of that injury. However everybody knows damn well that if IMG had lost their QB instead and lost the game in similar fashion, the narrative would be completely different. I realize you aren't making that argument. But it's recent and relevant example to what we were talking about above.

 

 

[Sammyswordsman]

10 hours ago, NorCalRuss said:

Don't forget about Folsom!!! They've been ahead 56-8 and 41-9 at the half in their first 2 games. Big local game this week against small school power Oakdale in one of the best venues to play at the "Corral". 

Folsom new qb is pretty impressive and they're #1 team in Sac area and prob #2 in NorCal again. 

http://www.blackhatfootball.com/2017/09/03/must-see-videoa-monsters-coming-to-the-corral-are-oakdales-mustangs-ready-for-sacramentos-super-team/

Tier 4

[Pops]

2 hours ago, ECHS05 said:

VM had hardly any flags in GA. The officiating actually helped them keep the score 26-7 instead of 30-7.

The next week at Mission Viejo they had 12 flags... TWELVE...before I fell asleep early in the 3rd quarter. Wrap your head around that. That contributed a lot to the score. 

Homer officiating in GA is like playing African Americans used to be is Sec basketball

1 at home, 2 on the road, 3 if you're behind

they didn't need it for one of GA's top teams against a CA team that's going to start 0-4

[Bucfootball90]

I can't see Pickerington central, OH as a top 100 team in the nation.  I feel like that's just an OH power state ranking  

They squeak by Detroit Cass Tech

Det cass Tech squeaks by Chicago Simeon, IL

Chicago Simeon, IL gets pummeled by top 10 IL teams.  

 

That being said it's not an easy job and I enjoy going over your rankings. 

[Gospeeder]

13 hours ago, Horsefly said:

Texas schools, like Allen, just started practices on 14th Aug.  they are way behind a lot of programs in getting started with the first games being played last week. (UIL pushed the schedules back one week, so teams played week 1, one week later this year)  Allen is good for right now until they have more time on the field. 

Smart post. Its good to see someone with levity in their observations relative to early season rankings. The UIL if I am not mistaken, recently followed what the CIF and Illinois HSAA did a couple of years ago in restricting contact and practice times prior to season openers. IMO. it is a huge disadvantage in early season games, especially when they are OOS with teams from less restrictive states.