HawgGoneIt Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 1 minute ago, concha said: You guys. . The need for it is what birthed it. Stop playing dense. Come on... let's drill just a little deeper yet though. We are getting close to the root cause now. Just a little further. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
World Citizen Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 7 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: The need for it is what birthed it. Stop playing dense. Come on... let's drill just a little deeper yet though. We are getting close to the root cause now. Just a little further. Because they are considered 'others'? Just a stab in the dark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
concha Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 49 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: The need for it is what birthed it. Stop playing dense. Come on... let's drill just a little deeper yet though. We are getting close to the root cause now. Just a little further. The cure proved worse than the ailment. But the faux appearance of charity has kept people voting. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CCBlackhatter Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 The racist white business owner is hard to blame when he packed up and moved his business from the inner city warzone. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorCalRuss Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 5 hours ago, Sportsnut said: Military state? I don't think so. Just let it be a war zone. Makes perfect sense. "We hate the police", don't let police clean it up, that would be a war zone. We see how well it's going now..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorCalRuss Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 Don't see poor white trash areas shooting each other up tallying up hundreds of victims in a weekend. Maybe their poverty is different than others in big cities... Right? Must be something whitey put in Chicagos water.... Its like when people say " so and so countries don't have many officer involved shootings". Well those countries don't have to deal with the vast amount of scum bags that America has on a daily basis either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron169 Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 I'm not going to say that a Democrat run regime is the root cause of violence in Chiraq, but I think we can definitely say it's not the answer. That being said, I don't think the answer is Republican leadership either. The only fox starts at home, each and every home. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 1 hour ago, CCBlackhatter said: The racist white business owner is hard to blame when he packed up and moved his business from the inner city warzone. Ha... now we are starting to touch on some stuff. White flight. This happened long before these areas became "warzones". No? If those folks stayed in those areas and offered jobs to the people living in the neighborhood, it would have been one small step in stopping what we see now. Instead, they took flight and sold their homes to slum lords that let them become blighted and the quality of life diminished with the homes. This is just one block in the foundation that gets ignored while we are busy talking past each other instead of being pragmatic and trying to actually solve problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 38 minutes ago, NorCalRuss said: Don't see poor white trash areas shooting each other up tallying up hundreds of victims in a weekend. Maybe their poverty is different than others in big cities... Right? Must be something whitey put in Chicagos water.... Its like when people say " so and so countries don't have many officer involved shootings". Well those countries don't have to deal with the vast amount of scum bags that America has on a daily basis either. No this is trying to look for the answer in the wrong place. "Whitey" hasn't been trying to rise from slavery and had to face the same biases. Can we say the same stuff would be happen in predominantly black communities if they did in fact have the exact same opportunities as "whitey". Hmm, after looking at it from that angle, the "whitey" putting something in the water analogy, while not exactly true, could be metaphorically true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 12 minutes ago, ron169 said: I'm not going to say that a Democrat run regime is the root cause of violence in Chiraq, but I think we can definitely say it's not the answer. That being said, I don't think the answer is Republican leadership either. The only fox starts at home, each and every home. Yes sir. Only now, we have a couple of centuries to overcome. And we have maybe less time than that to overcome as far as the republican/democrat part goes. Like I said before, as long as the two parties talk past each other, nothing gets solved. It's far past time for pragmatists to prevail and start solving issues instead of winning elections. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealCAJ Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 Rest easy, Chicago! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CCBlackhatter Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 37 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: No this is trying to look for the answer in the wrong place. "Whitey" hasn't been trying to rise from slavery and had to face the same biases. Can we say the same stuff would be happen in predominantly black communities if they did in fact have the exact same opportunities as "whitey". Hmm, after looking at it from that angle, the "whitey" putting something in the water analogy, while not exactly true, could be metaphorically true. I believe "the rising from slavery" angle is a big factor in why we will never find the solution. That is looking for the answer in the wrong place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thc6795 Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 15 minutes ago, TheRealCAJ said: Rest easy, Chicago! See you have added your usual. NOTHING. Go off and fall asleep very slow forever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOCIntellectualProperty Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 1 hour ago, NorCalRuss said: Don't see poor white trash areas shooting each other up tallying up hundreds of victims in a weekend. Maybe their poverty is different than others in big cities... Right? Must be something whitey put in Chicagos water.... Its like when people say " so and so countries don't have many officer involved shootings". Well those countries don't have to deal with the vast amount of scum bags that America has on a daily basis either. Boy... I used to love it when idiot conservatives make a fool of themselves... now it just frustrates and aggravates me in my older age This is mainly because they phrase shit so well... all the while not having a fucking clue about what they're bumping their gums on. How many times do you debate these fools only for them to either bow out, change the subject mid-debate... or go full retard with memes? The only reason Chicago has more murders than Podunk Texas dumbass ... is because Chicago has more people... Wanna know what these Hick towns have in common (Weldon, North Carolina .... Welsston, Missouri ........ Mangonia Park, Florida ..... Alturas, California ... Hawkins, Texas ..... Arcola, Texas .... Lockland, Ohio ..... Cairo, Illinois .... Lake City, Georgia ....and Quitman, Texas ) THEY ALL HAVE LARGER MURDER RATES THAN CHICAGO My biggest problem with this is there's absolutely NO WAY you wouldn't know this if you actually read yourself.... and not parroted shit off of Talk Radio and Fox: you know, the uniformly idiot shit you see copied and pasted over and over by all conservatives.. all over the internet.. Go back to sleep boy... your sheep is waiting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
concha Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 28 minutes ago, SOCIntellectualProperty said: Boy... I used to love it when idiot conservatives make a fool of themselves... now it just frustrates and aggravates me in my older age This is mainly because they phrase shit so well... all the while not having a fucking clue about what they're bumping their gums on. How many times do you debate these fools only for them to either bow out, change the subject mid-debate... or go full retard with memes? The only reason Chicago has more murders than Podunk Texas dumbass ... is because Chicago has more people... Wanna know what these Hick towns have in common (Weldon, North Carolina .... Welsston, Missouri ........ Mangonia Park, Florida ..... Alturas, California ... Hawkins, Texas ..... Arcola, Texas .... Lockland, Ohio ..... Cairo, Illinois .... Lake City, Georgia ....and Quitman, Texas ) THEY ALL HAVE LARGER MURDER RATES THAN CHICAGO My biggest problem with this is there's absolutely NO WAY you wouldn't know this if you actually read yourself.... and not parroted shit off of Talk Radio and Fox: you know, the uniformly idiot shit you see copied and pasted over and over by all conservatives.. all over the internet.. Go back to sleep boy... your sheep is waiting You are literally posting the names of towns (many of which are predominantly black, btw) where a single murder in a year could put them over the rate of a major metro area. Silly. "Chicago's" murder rate is actually watered down. Chicago has a murder rate of about 17 per 100,000 population (much higher than NYC and LA). However, the vast majority of murders happen in the south side and a few western areas. Amongst those populations the murder rates are stratospheric. In Austin (Chicago), the murder rate this year so far is about 90 per 100k (and there are about 100k people in the area). In Englewood (pop @ 30k) it's on track for well over 200 per 100k. And by the way, this ignores that the numbers of people shot and wounded are many multiples of these rates. For example, in Austin so far this year, nearly 5x as many people have been wounded as have been murdered. Englewood is on a pace to have about 3% of its population murdered or wounded this year. Holy shit! The following site has detailed data on the situation in Chicago. http://heyjackass.com/ . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 1 hour ago, CCBlackhatter said: I believe "the rising from slavery" angle is a big factor in why we will never find the solution. That is looking for the answer in the wrong place. I think there is some truth to the "playing the part of the victim" stuff that you hint at here. And I agree with Drummer that there has to be some personal responsibility on everyone's part. We can't ignore the fact that slavery was real, and we can't ignore the fact that only 50 or so years ago did the rules change to the point of bringing people to be truly equal in the eyes of the law. I know all the sad old arguments that we don't know anyone that owned a slave and whatever, but that doesn't change the fact that this isn't that far removed. Yes, there is a mentality with that, on both sides of the issue, and that is problematic. There is the victim side, which has caused a level of resentment, and maybe understandably so to an extent, then there is the acrimonious side that resents that there actually were victims and they now have to give up a little bit of their "we are better than you" mentality. We aren't looking in the wrong place if we are simply using that history to understand why mentalities are what they are now. I'm not saying any one person btw, I mean mentalities in general. Welfare has in fact created an atmosphere where people can survive without working. The key word in that is "survive". Hardly anyone wants to just survive. Most people want to do better than just survive, but due to more causes than just "democratic policies", there is a level of hopelessness. That's just the truth of it. I mean, I would love to just continually throw out there that republican policies that continually cause a rise and crash roller coaster ride for the economy, and create larger and larger wealth gaps, are what cause this, but that would be just as disingenuous as just saying democratic policies cause it. Both cause it, proliferate it, along with numerous other issues, yes, including bias. Welfare to work programs could probably help with these things, but just filling out apps shouldn't be enough to keep receiving benefits. There has to be a concerted effort. It took over 200 years to get here, so it's not something that will be solved overnight. It's not even something that will be solved in a decade. What I do know, is it will never ever be solved until we all take responsibility for letting it get here. Standing around and pointing fingers has been so helpful though. maybe we can just keep doing that. I'm sure that'll get it solved eventually. Yeah, you have to do something with the gangs now. You have to start working on changing the cultures of fatherless homes too though. If you keep locking up the fathers then the cycle continues. Not that all fatherless homes are created that way, but yeah you follow I hope. It's big problems. They took centuries to get here. At some point we have to learn from history and dig in to fix it. That starts with leaving ideals to the side and working toward a common goal. I hate to say it, but the biggest key and part of that common goal is, real, true, actual equality. Not the make pretend shit that we have now. Not the sanctimonious attitudes that white folks have now, that yeah people of color have the same chances and opportunities when they really don't. We have come a long way on some of that, but places like Chicago, if nothing else, prove that there is a long ass way still to go on both sides of the issue. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorCalRuss Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 5 hours ago, SOCIntellectualProperty said: Boy... I used to love it when idiot conservatives make a fool of themselves... now it just frustrates and aggravates me in my older age This is mainly because they phrase shit so well... all the while not having a fucking clue about what they're bumping their gums on. How many times do you debate these fools only for them to either bow out, change the subject mid-debate... or go full retard with memes? The only reason Chicago has more murders than Podunk Texas dumbass ... is because Chicago has more people... Wanna know what these Hick towns have in common (Weldon, North Carolina .... Welsston, Missouri ........ Mangonia Park, Florida ..... Alturas, California ... Hawkins, Texas ..... Arcola, Texas .... Lockland, Ohio ..... Cairo, Illinois .... Lake City, Georgia ....and Quitman, Texas ) THEY ALL HAVE LARGER MURDER RATES THAN CHICAGO My biggest problem with this is there's absolutely NO WAY you wouldn't know this if you actually read yourself.... and not parroted shit off of Talk Radio and Fox: you know, the uniformly idiot shit you see copied and pasted over and over by all conservatives.. all over the internet.. Go back to sleep boy... your sheep is waiting 5 hours ago, SOCIntellectualProperty said: Boy... I used to love it when idiot conservatives make a fool of themselves... now it just frustrates and aggravates me in my older age This is mainly because they phrase shit so well... all the while not having a fucking clue about what they're bumping their gums on. How many times do you debate these fools only for them to either bow out, change the subject mid-debate... or go full retard with memes? The only reason Chicago has more murders than Podunk Texas dumbass ... is because Chicago has more people... Wanna know what these Hick towns have in common (Weldon, North Carolina .... Welsston, Missouri ........ Mangonia Park, Florida ..... Alturas, California ... Hawkins, Texas ..... Arcola, Texas .... Lockland, Ohio ..... Cairo, Illinois .... Lake City, Georgia ....and Quitman, Texas ) THEY ALL HAVE LARGER MURDER RATES THAN CHICAGO My biggest problem with this is there's absolutely NO WAY you wouldn't know this if you actually read yourself.... and not parroted shit off of Talk Radio and Fox: you know, the uniformly idiot shit you see copied and pasted over and over by all conservatives.. all over the internet.. Go back to sleep boy... your sheep is waiting Clearly your clown ass has no understanding of statistics. Let me know next time there's 100 shootings in a weekend in any of those cities. Let me know when it's ever close to that in a white county-neighborhood... ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOCIntellectualProperty Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 2 hours ago, NorCalRuss said: Clearly your clown ass has no understanding of statistics. In the hood this move is called broad projection... you're behaving like a homosexual Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOCIntellectualProperty Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 7 hours ago, concha said: You are literally posting the names of towns (many of which are predominantly black, btw) where a single murder in a year could put them over the rate of a major metro area. Silly. those were just a few..... there are over 50 cities..some big ones and MANY white ones with a higher crime rate than Chicago what's silly is when fools repeatedly use this city as a buzzword because that's what's in at the moment.... while not knowing what they're talking about when your dumb friend asks shit like did 'whitey put something in the water?' , he's insinuating that whites are inherently and naturally less violent than blacks... as if he completely failed every history he's ever taken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
concha Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 4 hours ago, SOCIntellectualProperty said: those were just a few..... there are over 50 cities..some big ones and MANY white ones with a higher crime rate than Chicago what's silly is when fools repeatedly use this city as a buzzword because that's what's in at the moment.... while not knowing what they're talking about when your dumb friend asks shit like did 'whitey put something in the water?' , he's insinuating that whites are inherently and naturally less violent than blacks... as if he completely failed every history he's ever taken The comment was inappropriate and it rubbed me the wrong way also. I'm curious what cities of real size that are white-dominated have higher crime rates than Chicago? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
concha Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 4 minutes ago, Drummer61 said: You got em concha..... The Dems will lead all poor people to continued poverty and the cities they control into Detroit and Ferguson... I see the nanny state and the current Dem and union-dominated, no school choice educational system as doom for the majority of ANYONE that gets stuck in them. Combine it with the identity politics and victim culture promoted by the left and here we are. . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealCAJ Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 6 hours ago, SOCIntellectualProperty said: those were just a few..... there are over 50 cities..some big ones and MANY white ones with a higher crime rate than Chicago what's silly is when fools repeatedly use this city as a buzzword because that's what's in at the moment.... while not knowing what they're talking about when your dumb friend asks shit like did 'whitey put something in the water?' , he's insinuating that whites are inherently and naturally less violent than blacks... as if he completely failed every history he's ever taken Republicans gave up on our large cities decades ago. They don't even hide it anymore. A real shame. The GOP "ideology" just doesn't work in our cities, but is a hit in bumfuck, Montana... Come election time though the GOP is all about this and that in our cities and throw blame around like a 7 year old. Makes me puke. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 2 hours ago, Drummer61 said: You got em concha..... The Dems will lead all poor people to continued poverty and the cities they control into Detroit and Ferguson... Nope. Sorry. You know what really causes the issue is the huge wealth gap. I know, I know, we can't punish people for being successful, so in their stead, we choose to punish the poor. Either way, someone is getting punished in the system we have. The more wealth that the top accumulates, and the fewer people that it's distributed among, the more growth actually stagnates. They just simply are not reinvesting it at a rate that keeps up with population growth. That's the real elephant in the room. How you fix that is beyond me, but, I think if there was enough of it invested back to move everyone up a rung on the economic ladder more than once every 50 yrs or so, we would see a lot better situation. The people that are really investing and creating the most growth are not the people with the most disposable income. They are the people that are getting pinched out by the rest. Fix that and you solve a great percentage of all the problems we have. You can't have one class leaving the rest behind the rate we have without the system failing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
concha Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 5 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: Nope. Sorry. You know what really causes the issue is the huge wealth gap. I know, I know, we can't punish people for being successful, so in their stead, we choose to punish the poor. Either way, someone is getting punished in the system we have. The more wealth that the top accumulates, and the fewer people that it's distributed among, the more growth actually stagnates. They just simply are not reinvesting it at a rate that keeps up with population growth. That's the real elephant in the room. How you fix that is beyond me, but, I think if there was enough of it invested back to move everyone up a rung on the economic ladder more than once every 50 yrs or so, we would see a lot better situation. The people that are really investing and creating the most growth are not the people with the most disposable income. They are the people that are getting pinched out by the rest. Fix that and you solve a great percentage of all the problems we have. You can't have one class leaving the rest behind the rate we have without the system failing. Bigger government has failed. Wealth inequality has worsened. Many poor - especially minorities - are trapped in the system designed to help them keep them voting Democrat. . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMaximumHornetSting Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 15 hours ago, HawgGoneIt said: I think there is some truth to the "playing the part of the victim" stuff that you hint at here. And I agree with Drummer that there has to be some personal responsibility on everyone's part. We can't ignore the fact that slavery was real, and we can't ignore the fact that only 50 or so years ago did the rules change to the point of bringing people to be truly equal in the eyes of the law. I know all the sad old arguments that we don't know anyone that owned a slave and whatever, but that doesn't change the fact that this isn't that far removed. Yes, there is a mentality with that, on both sides of the issue, and that is problematic. There is the victim side, which has caused a level of resentment, and maybe understandably so to an extent, then there is the acrimonious side that resents that there actually were victims and they now have to give up a little bit of their "we are better than you" mentality. We aren't looking in the wrong place if we are simply using that history to understand why mentalities are what they are now. I'm not saying any one person btw, I mean mentalities in general. Welfare has in fact created an atmosphere where people can survive without working. The key word in that is "survive". Hardly anyone wants to just survive. Most people want to do better than just survive, but due to more causes than just "democratic policies", there is a level of hopelessness. That's just the truth of it. I mean, I would love to just continually throw out there that republican policies that continually cause a rise and crash roller coaster ride for the economy, and create larger and larger wealth gaps, are what cause this, but that would be just as disingenuous as just saying democratic policies cause it. Both cause it, proliferate it, along with numerous other issues, yes, including bias. Welfare to work programs could probably help with these things, but just filling out apps shouldn't be enough to keep receiving benefits. There has to be a concerted effort. It took over 200 years to get here, so it's not something that will be solved overnight. It's not even something that will be solved in a decade. What I do know, is it will never ever be solved until we all take responsibility for letting it get here. Standing around and pointing fingers has been so helpful though. maybe we can just keep doing that. I'm sure that'll get it solved eventually. Yeah, you have to do something with the gangs now. You have to start working on changing the cultures of fatherless homes too though. If you keep locking up the fathers then the cycle continues. Not that all fatherless homes are created that way, but yeah you follow I hope. It's big problems. They took centuries to get here. At some point we have to learn from history and dig in to fix it. That starts with leaving ideals to the side and working toward a common goal. I hate to say it, but the biggest key and part of that common goal is, real, true, actual equality. Not the make pretend shit that we have now. Not the sanctimonious attitudes that white folks have now, that yeah people of color have the same chances and opportunities when they really don't. We have come a long way on some of that, but places like Chicago, if nothing else, prove that there is a long ass way still to go on both sides of the issue. Learning from history huh? Instead of learning from Histories mistakes people use Those mistakes to Justify their cause.... And thats a horrible mindset. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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